FORUM CLOSING ON 14th JANUARY

Beefy · Ultimate Poster (Breaks off in decider)

2012-13 Winter League Results

Tashy · Senior Poster (Pots off the break)

midget c get a peach of a result

midget c 11 peachcroft b 4

utm

Tashy · Senior Poster (Pots off the break)

Midget 10 saxton arms 5

Terrible result really considering we were 6 nil up

But still another win and still unbeaten

Utm

The Grinder · Senior Poster (Pots off the break)

Well... Complete joke tonight!

Crown House Devils v Midget

The Midget turned up with 7 players but Tashy said before the start that they wanted to play Pete but that he might be late so could they leave the last name blank and if he was there he would play. We agreed. He wasn't there in time so another name was put in (although it had been asked that all Pete's frames be played when he got there, meaning that in the end we wouldn't have completed either of the first two legs until Pete turned up at 10:15!). But obviously Tashy had already seen our draw before he then put a player in instead of Pete given that we didn't agree to Pete not effectively playing all his frames in the last leg! So I think he put a weaker player in (Coops instead of Manse) because it was against one of our weaker players (me, although I won that frame). Then on the second leg Tashy again left the last name blank without saying anything about it (even though there were still six other players to choose from at that point!). We argued it, saying that the point of a blind draw was that it was blind! And we didn't agree to play the frame. He then put a player in when the score of the second leg (up til that point) was known. We tried to say that him not putting a name in meant that they'd given us the frame (it's not as though they didn't have enough players!), but given that the score was close they then chose to put Manse in, and it was played by us in order to not start a feud. THEN! In the last leg, 5 minutes after the names had been put down (given that we had put our players down in a certain order in case it came to a decider) we were asked (by his missus!) if the player that they had put on last could play second as he had to go!!!! Which meant that our player that we had put on last had to play earlier, and someone who generally always plays last for them (Tashy!) ended up played last!! Talk about fixing it all the way through.

We lost 8-7, but we're going to take it up with the league to see what the rules are in these circumstances. Presumably the second leg (at least!) should be loss of frame for not putting any name down (and not even saying anything about it!). Also thank you to a member of their team that said that we had a fair point because it wasn't as though they were short of players!

Super Midget CCCC · Regular Poster (Wins the toss)

Crown house devils 7-8 Midget C

Great result team, should of been more but its still a good win.

Can't really comment on what nikki has said as I wasn't really aware we were leaving the card blank, but at the same time I can understand why Tashy wanted to give Pete a chance of playing as this was a big game so of course you want your top players to play. I'd understand if he was at home watching tv, but he was playing in a big memorial pool tournament. We did have more players to play as well but a few of them didn't want to play, but just to watch including manse

Also Kev was there last night so surely it would of made sense to speak to him?

The Grinder · Senior Poster (Pots off the break)

I completely understand wanting to play Pete as well, which is why we agreed that the last name could be kept blank on the first leg and that he would play if he was there in time. But he didn't actually arrive until 10:15 - the other match at the Crown House was finished by then and so have plenty of our other matches in the past! We put our players down in a certain order for a reason, and effectively if we had waited for Pete it would have meant me not playing any of my frames until he arrived very late in the evening, and then having to play them all at once - not how the league is supposed to be played!

And yes, in theory talking to Kev last night would have been a sensible option, had he not been plastered! From past experience we thought it best to wait until he had sobered up before speaking to him!

The Pool Shark · Ultimate Poster (Breaks off in decider)

The Grinder wrote:
And yes, in theory talking to Kev last night would have been a sensible option, had he not been plastered! From past experience we thought it best to wait until he had sobered up before speaking to him!

Medication for that poor old back of his, no doubt. wink

MING · Ultimate Poster (2-0 up in a best of 7)

The Grinder wrote:
Well... Complete joke tonight!
Crown House Devils v Midget
The Midget turned up with 7 players but Tashy said before the start that they wanted to play Pete but that he might be late so could they leave the last name blank and if he was there he would play. We agreed. He wasn't there in time so another name was put in (although it had been asked that all Pete's frames be played when he got there, meaning that in the end we wouldn't have completed either of the first two legs until Pete turned up at 10:15!). But obviously Tashy had already seen our draw before he then put a player in instead of Pete given that we didn't agree to Pete not effectively playing all his frames in the last leg! So I think he put a weaker player in (Coops instead of Manse) because it was against one of our weaker players (me, although I won that frame). Then on the second leg Tashy again left the last name blank without saying anything about it (even though there were still six other players to choose from at that point!). We argued it, saying that the point of a blind draw was that it was blind! And we didn't agree to play the frame. He then put a player in when the score of the second leg (up til that point) was known. We tried to say that him not putting a name in meant that they'd given us the frame (it's not as though they didn't have enough players!), but given that the score was close they then chose to put Manse in, and it was played by us in order to not start a feud. THEN! In the last leg, 5 minutes after the names had been put down (given that we had put our players down in a certain order in case it came to a decider) we were asked (by his missus!) if the player that they had put on last could play second as he had to go!!!! Which meant that our player that we had put on last had to play earlier, and someone who generally always plays last for them (Tashy!) ended up played last!! Talk about fixing it all the way through.
We lost 8-7, but we're going to take it up with the league to see what the rules are in these circumstances. Presumably the second leg (at least!) should be loss of frame for not putting any name down (and not even saying anything about it!). Also thank you to a member of their team that said that we had a fair point because it wasn't as though they were short of players!

On the first issue, the league rules stipulate "there will be occasions where a player from a team consisting of a basic 5 players, may be working later in the evening or will be late arriving following work. Current niceties (though NO obligation exists) permit said player(s) to play all his/her frames early prior to work or late upon their arrival from work i.e. out of the order on the Result Card" Therefore the Devils could've and should've forced the Midget to us their subs...

On the second issue the Devils could've just allowed the Midget players to change position on the card or insist that the order was kept (I don't know why the player who was down last needed to change so can't comment further)

Finally, when there is a problem Captains are reminded that they should contact one of the committee members before doing anything else, who will then make an interim decision, Beefy was at the Crown House so was readily available... There's very little the league can do afterwards

Stoppa · Newbie (50p on the table)

Kev,I didn't agree to play the last frame in second leg,Tashy left it blank and had said nothing to me about it! After hearing that his players that he had there didn't actually want to play I'm led to believe there is no player for that frame,The idea of a blind draw is that it's actually blind!? Tashy then says during my frame (9th frame) that Pete is on his way an could we start the last leg then pete will play when he gets here,I said to Tashy that there should be a name on the paper you've got enough players here to pick from and you've not said anything to me, as far as I can see there is no player for that frame so the win will go to the devils. Tashy then picks one of three players to choose from to play the last frame! Also waiting untill he knew the score (in both the first and second leg) before putting a player in. That isn't right! the frame went ahed to keep the piece on the night as I thought I would be able to sort this out with the league. The player wasn't late due to work as you well know. The match starts at 7:30 a player turning up at 10:15 is good for no one,were normally finished or back at home by that time!
You say that nothing can be done after the match?? I seam to remember my team being docked 3 frames after a match (witch cost us the league) for somthing that both teams were involved in,this match has no real value to it just what's right and wrong and I don't agree with what happend. Seams like there's one rule for one and one for another!

Tashy · Senior Poster (Pots off the break)

I really can't wait until finals and presentation night, I'm looking forward to seeing who the Booker Prize for literature goes to this season. We've had some really good novels in the first half of the season, I really can't wait to see what the sequels will be like (due for publication 13th/14th january 2013) and

who know's there may even be a trilogy out there!!! This seasons special guest presenter will be the world acclaimed author Kingsley Amis who won this outstanding award in 1986 with his truly amazing piece of literary composition " The Old Devil "

-- Edited by Tashy on Wednesday 28th of November 2012 09:56:49 AM

MING · Ultimate Poster (2-0 up in a best of 7)

Stoppa wrote:
Kev,I didn't agree to play the last frame in second leg,Tashy left it blank and had said nothing to me about it! After hearing that his players that he had there didn't actually want to play I'm led to believe there is no player for that frame,The idea of a blind draw is that it's actually blind!? Tashy then says during my frame (9th frame) that Pete is on his way an could we start the last leg then pete will play when he gets here,I said to Tashy that there should be a name on the paper you've got enough players here to pick from and you've not said anything to me, as far as I can see there is no player for that frame so the win will go to the devils. Tashy then picks one of three players to choose from to play the last frame! Also waiting untill he knew the score (in both the first and second leg) before putting a player in. That isn't right! the frame went ahed to keep the piece on the night as I thought I would be able to sort this out with the league. The player wasn't late due to work as you well know. The match starts at 7:30 a player turning up at 10:15 is good for no one,were normally finished or back at home by that time!
You say that nothing can be done after the match?? I seam to remember my team being docked 3 frames after a match (witch cost us the league) for somthing that both teams were involved in,this match has no real value to it just what's right and wrong and I don't agree with what happend. Seams like there's one rule for one and one for another!

Sometimes I dispair at the childishness diplayed by teams, mainly the top teams too, during pool matches and are preisely the reason that the Committees spend time devising rules that cover every possible senario imaginable...

As I have already said, if a disagreement arises, then the aggrieved Captain shoud attempt to contact a committee member who will rule o what should happen. It's no good bitchin' afterwards if Captains fail to do this and in this particular case it's even moe galling as Beefy was in attendance...

Reading between the lines (correct me if I'm wrong), one assumes that the Devils agreed to allow the 5th position in the first leg to remain blank in case Pete Mac made it back in time. If this was the case then it's safe to assume that the Midget expected the same allowance in the second leg.

As I posted earlier, teams are under no obligation to make allowances for teams that are short of players especially as there are reserves present and equally teams shouldn't just expect allowances to be made. However, in this instance the Devils made a rod for their own back by allowing such an allowance in the 1st leg...

The proper proceedure would be for the Devils to insst that the card was filled out correctly and a reserve listed or Pete Mac listed with the Midget taking a risk that he would attend on time or an agreement that Pete could play all his frames once he arrived.... Common-sense would have dictated that the Midget left the 5th position blank and then use a reserve if he hadn't arrived by that time

Now what I can't fathom is why did the Devils allow the 5th position in the 1st leg to be left blank but seemingly had a problem with this happing in the 2nd leg ? By your own admission, the Midget played a weaker player and considering it was the 5h position that was being left blank, the Devils could've selected their team accordingly, so I can't see what advantage the Midget would have gained.

Finally, any complaint (and you ca make an official one if you wish) are decided on their own merits and previous icisions have no berring current ones, unless it's the same offence. Also, you lost the league by 4 points last season so any penaly had no overall affect on your final placing....

Super Midget CCCC · Regular Poster (Wins the toss)

This may be usefull for further posts... http://oxforddictionaries.com/

-- Edited by Super Midget CCCC on Wednesday 28th of November 2012 10:15:04 AM

BURT · Regular Poster (Wins the toss)

I have made a note of these underhand tactics and will make my captain aware although I doubt Tashy will be playing against us so will have more time to fill in the card appropriately.

the red devil · Regular Poster (Wins the toss)

Super Midget CCCC wrote:
This may be usefull for further posts... http://oxforddictionaries.com/

-- Edited by Super Midget CCCC on Wednesday 28th of November 2012 10:15:04 AM

Or a pen that doesn't run out after 4 names!

Sat-Nav · Regular Poster (Wins the toss)

Looks like i missed an entertaining night, from my experience most section 1 teams would be happy taking 7 frames off of a prem team, seems the Devils have bigger aspirations!

BURT · Regular Poster (Wins the toss)

Demos 7 - 8 Devils

Not to sure on the individual results as I was running late and only managed to turn up near the end of the third leg

Thankfully they allowed me to play my three frames on arrival so much appreciated Devils!

MING · Ultimate Poster (2-0 up in a best of 7)

BURT wrote:
Demos 7 - 8 Devils

Not to sure on the individual results as I was running late and only managed to turn up near the end of the third leg

Thankfully they allowed me to play my three frames on arrival so much appreciated Devils!

and why not! as Barry Norman would say. They were pretty much guaranteed to win them anyway...

BURT · Regular Poster (Wins the toss)

They managed to get one off me.... given my current form they will be disappointed.