FORUM CLOSING ON 14th JANUARY

Beefy · Ultimate Poster (Breaks off in decider)

RE: Rumour ?

MING · Ultimate Poster (2-0 up in a best of 7)

Milhouse wrote:

Ming has said that you have changed the rules to allow him in !!!

Where exactly? I believe the word i used was revised. The actual rule regarding Wildcards was unwritten and operated on an adhoc basis. All that was done was that it was clarified so that everyone was clear where they stood.

8ball · Senior Poster (Nominates their colour)

Oh dear oh dear, looks like a case of "insider trading" by the people who run the O.C.P.F.

Firstly I would like to say that Tom Weeks is a very good player who should no doubt strengthen the county squad. That said he, like myself and 40 plus other players had our chance to qualify at the trails but DID NOT.

JFK Wrote; If people do not make retention levels then you have to enter the cauldron of trials and take your chances. Survival of the fittest. As for pissed off ... well like pool ... if you don't take your chances ....

Just like to point out like the rest of us Tom entered the couldron, wasn`t the fittest, didn`t survive and didn`t take his chances

The Chih wrote;

You seem to forget that the rules have now changed to Black Ball making them even closer to World Rules. Correct me if I am wrong but did Tom not finish top of the BAPTO Rules Thursday Night League Averages?????

If what your saying about the rule change is right then it should have been easier for him to qualify. As for finishing top of the Thursday rankings should we then pick the top 10 and give them all wild cards

Ming wrote; Unfortunately, at the moment the EPCF couldn't run a piss up in a brewery.

Is this a case of the pot calling the kettle names ?

Ming wrote;

milhouse wrote:

Does this mean other good players who went to trials like Shaun Taylor, Pete Timms, Graham Hornblow, Julian Wood are all going to be given backdoor tickets aswell ?

No offence, but what exactly have they done that puts them in the same bracket as Tom? C.V's please.

We all failed to qualify on trails day !

It would seem that the O.C.P.F. is being run by people who like to pick which players they want. Maybe an easier way would be to start with your list of players, start at the top and phone people in order until you get enough for the squad. At least that way it would save a lot of people time & money on a system of qualification that is obviously flawed.

pots · Senior Poster (Pots off the break)

pete my cv in pool has got nothing todo with wats going on here when i started playing pool it was a completely different ball game, now its all about potting thats why theirs alot more good potters and alot more eight ballers something you no nothing about ,come in to the real world of pool and and pot some balls for a change instead of all the filth you dish out

8ball · Senior Poster (Nominates their colour)

Pots you old charmer

Luckylewis · Even if you beat me I’m STILL THE BEST ;-)

MING · Ultimate Poster (2-0 up in a best of 7)

8ball wrote:

Ming wrote;

Unfortunately, at the moment the EPCF couldn't run a piss up in a brewery.

Is this a case of the pot calling the kettle names ?

Sorry, are you seriously saying that i couldn't run a piss up in a brewery? Who needs a brewery

Maybe an easier way would be to start with your list of players, start at the top and phone people in order until you get enough for the squad. At least that way it would save a lot of people time & money on a system of qualification that is obviously flawed.

Using trials is flawed, i think we all accept that. That said we hold trials so that players who we may never have seen before can play. If we picked the squad on pure ability then who's to say who'd be in the squad. At the end of the day for players who were in the squad last season there were 4 ways in which to be in this years squad (1) Captains "Wildcard" (2) Reaching the retention mark during the normal season (3)Reaching the retention mark during the County Finals (4) Through the trials

I didn't remember you, or anyone else for that matter, complaining when the new retention mark was added for performances at the County Finals.

So, you, milhouse and 1000 others, lets see how you got on

(1) Captains "Wildcard" - not special enough

(2) Reaching the retention mark during the normal season - Failed

(3) Reaching the retention mark during the County Finals - Failed

(4) Through the trials -Failed

Tom

(1) Captains "Wildcard" - special player

(2) Reaching the retention mark during the normal season - never played

(3) Reaching the retention mark during the County Finals - never played

(4) Through the trials -Failed

It would seem that the O.C.P.F. is being run by people who like to pick which players they want.

The OCPF is run by people who have the County's best interests at heart and make all decisions on that basis.

Cue_Isty · Senior Poster (Pots off the break)

8ball wrote:

It would seem that the O.C.P.F. is being run by people who like to pick which players they want. Maybe an easier way would be to start with your list of players, start at the top and phone people in order until you get enough for the squad.

Finally, someone who's talking some sense.

What a great idea...

The Chin · Senior Poster (Pots off the break)

If anyone disagrees with the way the county is run they have two options....

1 - Don't play county

2 - Attend the AGM, get elected onto the committee and actively do something about it.

If you guys want the county run your way, get elected by the players onto the committee (as the current members have) and then you can make the decisions, and have it your way.

You could always try the Berkshire team, they only hold trials for places in their B and C teams, is that a better way??

JFK · Senior Poster (Nominates their colour)

8ball wrote:

It would seem that the O.C.P.F. is being run by people who like to pick which players they want. Maybe an easier way would be to start with your list of players, start at the top and phone people in order until you get enough for the squad. At least that way it would save a lot of people time & money on a system of qualification that is obviously flawed.

Doesn't take a lot for you [8 Ball]to chuck the toys out of the pram does it!!

The OCPF has only used, and correct me if I'm wrong (i might well be), 1 wildcard in the last 3 years - Jimmy Millar; and to be fair this was forced due to his England status at the time and predictably didn't really play anyway.

How unfair! What a terrible setup! Oh my god couldn't run anything fairly! How shallow! Awfull! Insider trading! Mates only!

Trials ARE flawed but until anyone (well somebody that actually understands the problems in organising a trial for 50+ people on 1 day with limited tables) comes up with a better solution AND can be bothered to turn upto the AGM, propose it AND carry it out then we're stuck with it. As trials are flawed then we do sometimes have to make decisions for the good of the county that may not be popular.

The OCPF committee put a lot of work into the county and if all it takes is the awarding of a 2nd wildcard in 3 years to a universally regarded quality player for you to class them as not being able to organise a piss up in a brewery then it says a lot about your knowledge of how to run a county setup ... all complaints no realistic solutions ...

The Chin "If you guys want the county run your way, get elected by the players onto the committee (as the current members have) and then you can make the decisions, and have it your way."

Totally Agree!!

-- Edited by JFK at 11:54, 2006-04-05

Milhouse · Ultimate Poster (2-0 up in a best of 7)

JFK wrote:

Doesn't take a lot for you [8 Ball]to chuck the toys out of the pram does it!! The OCPF has only used, and correct me if I'm wrong (i might well be), 1 wildcard in the last 3 years - Jimmy Millar; and to be fair this was forced due to his England status at the time and predictably didn't really play anyway.

I think you will find that 3 years ago, the OCPF used 5 wilcard places after trials.

run anything fairly! How shallow! Awfull! Insider trading! Mates only! Trials ARE flawed but until anyone (well somebody that actually understands the problems in organising a trial for 50+ people on 1 day with limited tables) comes up with a better solution AND can be bothered to turn upto the AGM, propose it AND carry it out then we're stuck with it. As trials are flawed then we do sometimes have to make decisions for the good of the county that may not be popular.The OCPF committee put a lot of work into the county and if all it takes is the awarding of a 2nd wildcard in 3 years to a universally regarded quality player for you to class them as not being able to organise a piss up in a brewery then it says a lot about your knowledge of how to run a county setup ... all complaints no realistic solutions ...

So with all these new rules about giving wildcard places, if someone like Tim Williamson or Brian Carroll came along half way through this season and said they would like to play, they would be given a wildcard place ?

Milhouse · Ultimate Poster (2-0 up in a best of 7)

8ball wrote:

Oh dear oh dear, looks like a case of "insider trading" by the people who run the O.C.P.F. Firstly I would like to say that Tom Weeks is a very good player who should no doubt strengthen the county squad. That said he, like myself and 40 plus other players had our chance to qualify at the trails but DID NOT.

JFK Wrote; If people do not make retention levels then you have to enter the cauldron of trials and take your chances. Survival of the fittest. As for pissed off ... well like pool ... if you don't take your chances .... Just like to point out like the rest of us Tom entered the couldron, wasn`t the fittest, didn`t survive and didn`t take his chances The Chih wrote; You seem to forget that the rules have now changed to Black Ball making them even closer to World Rules. Correct me if I am wrong but did Tom not finish top of the BAPTO Rules Thursday Night League Averages????? If what your saying about the rule change is right then it should have been easier for him to qualify. As for finishing top of the Thursday rankings should we then pick the top 10 and give them all wild cards

But they are NEW RULES, whichever way you look at it.

It would seem that the O.C.P.F. is being run by people who like to pick which players they want. Maybe an easier way would be to start with your list of players, start at the top and phone people in order until you get enough for the squad. At least that way it would save a lot of people time & money on a system of qualification that is obviously flawed.

It looks like this is the way its happening anyway...

Barney · Ultimate Poster (Breaks off in decider)

Milhouse wrote:

Maybe an easier way would be to start with your list of players, start at the top and phone people in order until you get enough for the squad. At least that way it would save a lot of people time & money on a system of qualification that is obviously flawed

It looks like this is the way its happening anyway...

Don't be so ridiculous. If this was true you wouldn't have got in the squad in the first place.

Beefy · Ultimate Poster (Breaks off in decider)

Milhouse wrote:

It would seem that the O.C.P.F. is being run by people who like to pick which players they want. Maybe an easier way would be to start with your list of players, start at the top and phone people in order until you get enough for the squad. At least that way it would save a lot of people time & money on a system of qualification that is obviously flawed. It looks like this is the way its happening anyway...

I don't remember the exact number of places at trials this year either 12 I think after retained players through the season, finals, national comps etc, etc.

How can you say this when only one wildcard has been awarded post trials on top of the two players from last year squad which were given wild cards also but BEFORE THE TRIALS. One A side player and B side player at the national finals.

I do not pick the teams but am confident they are picked on performance and availability of players from those IN THE SQUAD. I do know that there was a case last year relating to the Somerset Game when a certain B side player got a last minute pick minute when one of the squad picked for Somerset away pulled out. The highest ranked player was then called up and said yes. I am not naming names but he knows who he was and I expect this was not the only example of this during last year.

I had won a high percentage of games in the B's 9 from 12 and then played in the A's winning 5 from 6 so consistancy keeps you in the teams. (Yes some were fortunate wins via some bad play from opponents at berkshire)

It seemed a simple equation last year

Get picked

win games and stay in - lose games and you were dropped

Seems a fair enough way to me.

I would also like to say that a lot of time and effort was put in by the committee last year in securing prize money for competitions, which not many county players then attended, organising trials, team selection, shirts and not to say the effort required for the national finals etc.

I don't remember seeing many of the people posting on this thread at the AGM like the Chin said turn up have your say and vote accordingly like the people who turned up this year did and they voted accordingly.

So if your going to turn up at an AGM don't moan about things that are changed at it afterwards !

Barney · Ultimate Poster (Breaks off in decider)

JFK wrote:

The Chin "If you guys want the county run your way, get elected by the players onto the committee (as the current members have) and then you can make the decisions, and have it your way."

Totally Agree!!--

At the recent County AGM there were more Committee people than non-Committee people which in my opinion is a poor show. This was the county squad's (or anyone's for that matter) opportunity to raise issues or thoughts with the Committee but wasn't taken. This could have been raised then.

Now obviously someone may point out that this "wild card" hadn't been given then. BUT if this is the 2nd in 5 years or whatever then it's not really that serious. If it's something that has happened more often (as suggested by Mill House) then it would be a more pressing issue that someone should have brought to the County AGM as it would have raised a similar problem in years previous.

Come on chaps, let's work together for a change, focus our attention on beating the various Berkshire, Somerset, Wiltshire and Hampshire teams, they are the enemy not our own Committee!

-- Edited by Barney at 13:21, 2006-04-05

Milhouse · Ultimate Poster (2-0 up in a best of 7)

Beefy wrote:

I don't remember seeing many of the people posting on this thread at the AGM like the Chin said turn up have your say and vote accordingly like the people who turned up this year did and they voted accordingly. So if your going to turn up at an AGM don't moan about things that are changed at it afterwards !

This wasn't changed at the agm, it is something that was "amended" afterwards

Milhouse · Ultimate Poster (2-0 up in a best of 7)

Barney wrote:

At the recent County AGM there were more Committee people than non-Committee people which in my opinion is a poor show. This was the county squad's (or anyone's for that matter) opportunity to raise issues or thoughts with the Committee but wasn't taken. This could have been raised then.

It couldn't have been raised then because it wasn't an issue then!

Now obviously someone may point out that this "wild card" hadn't been given then. BUT if this is the 2nd in 5 years or whatever then it's not really that serious. If it's something that has happened more often (as suggested by Mill House) then it would be a more pressing issue that someone should have brought to the County AGM as it would have raised a similar problem in years previous.

There has always been a problem with wildcards, thats why they were stopped being given out after trials.

Come on chaps, let's work together for a change, focus our attention on beating the various Berkshire, Somerset, Wiltshire and Hampshire teams, they are the enemy not our own Committee!-- Edited by Barney at 13:21, 2006-04-05

How can we work together when things like this happen ? It upsets people who have taken the time, effort and cost to compete in the trials and will then get shafted by someone who didn't get in?

Every game that Tom plays this season means that somebody who got it by their own right will be missing out on playing.

JFK · Senior Poster (Nominates their colour)

Milhouse :"I think you will find that 3 years ago, the OCPF used 5 wilcard places after trials. "

No it wasn't, the 5 PTW's were 4 trials ago ... which is when you started on the committee i believe.

Milhouse:"Every game that Tom plays this season means that somebody who got it by their own right will be missing out on playing."

The only way Tom will replace someone is that somebody is losing and Tom is winning. As posted easlier ... it's called competition. This is supposed to be county standard ... not the local playground. The squad can be up to 30 people. It was 28 and is now 29 we're are hardly costing people chances.

Milhouse: "So with all these new rules about giving wildcard places, if someone like Tim Williamson or Brian Carroll came along half way through this season and said they would like to play, they would be given a wildcard place ?"

Again Milhouse try and be accurate. THE 'new' (personally i'd call it improved!) rule allows flexibility .. why is this wrong as long as it is not abused. Since it only takes 1 member of the committee to block a wildcard this should be unlikely.

Milhouse:"How can we work together when things like this happen ? "

Sorry you feel like that. Well if you can't are you going to give your place in the squad up then? After all it would be unfair if you played instead of someone who actually wanted to play.

Barney: "Come on chaps, let's work together for a change, focus our attention on beating the various Berkshire, Somerset, Wiltshire and Hampshire teams"

Certainly couldn't have put it better!!

-- Edited by JFK at 14:10, 2006-04-05

Barney · Ultimate Poster (Breaks off in decider)

Milhouse wrote:

A load of crap.

The Chin · Senior Poster (Pots off the break)

Tim Williamson and Brian Carroll................. That would make it a strong team though!!

maximus · Regular Poster (Wins the toss)

Seen Tom play a couple of times this year.He deserves a wildcard.
In my humble opinion the county should field the strongest side it can.

quite simple really

8ball · Senior Poster (Nominates their colour)

JFK Wrote; Doesn't take a lot for you [8 Ball]to chuck the toys out of the pram does it!!

It`s not a case of chucking toys out of prams, I am just giving my opinions on this forum because I thought that`s what a forum is for, but it seems easy to hit a nerve if yuo ask the wrong question or make the wrong remark.

There is a system in place to select a squad for the County team (the tiails) failiure to qualify at the trials usually means that you don`t get selected for the squad. There are a lot of players who lasted longer in the trials and no doubt finished with a better record

You keep saying that other players won`t loose their place just because Tom has now been given a wild card, but as you keep saying he is a great player are you trying to tell us he won`t be selected for the first match ? If he is selected then he will obviosly be displacing another player who would otherwise have been selected to play.

JFK Wrote; The OCPF has only used, and correct me if I'm wrong (i might well be), 1 wildcard in the last 3 years - Jimmy Millar; and to be fair this was forced due to his England status at the time and predictably didn't really play anyway.

I quite sure Mr Ball was used at the first match 2 seasons ago even though he didn`t trial would that not be considered a wild card ?

sir_ramrod · Regular Poster (Wins the toss)

maximus wrote:

Seen Tom play a couple of times this year.He deserves a wildcard. In my humble opinion the county should field the strongest side it can. quite simple really

well said sir.....

someone like tom is clearly a cut above and although had a stinker of a day (which included 2 potted blacks follwed by the white) on trials day, he, in my opinion, should definately be offered a wild card.

At the end of the day we are all representing oxfordshire in some way so why not field the best team we can in doing so!

Milhouse, Keith etc.......... you should probably think about sloping off now and concentrating on winning your frames come county match time, i dont see why everyone has such a problem.

Beefy · Ultimate Poster (Breaks off in decider)

sir_ramrod wrote:

Keith etc.......... you should probably think about sloping off now and concentrating on winning your frames come county match time, i dont see why everyone has such a problem.

I was merely voicing my opinion on this subject and defending the situation but yes quite right John I am anticipating the new season which start on Sunday at the squad day !

I am still waiting for the official list so I can sort out the best way to collect moneis and have an adequate record of what is taken in on Sunday including shirt names and sizes etc !

e-mail me please.

keith.hollis@yahoo.co.uk

Beefy · Ultimate Poster (Breaks off in decider)

I can't remember the last time a thread was hit so many times and in such a short space of time !

See you all on Sunday for squad day.

Barney · Ultimate Poster (Breaks off in decider)

Beefy wrote:

I am still waiting for the official list so I can sort out the best way to collect moneis and have an adequate record of what is taken in on Sunday including shirt names and sizes etc ! e-mail me please. keith.hollis@yahoo.co.uk

Beefy, I gave Kev £5 on Monday. Plus I think Watty did the same. I'm away this weekend so won't see you Sunday.

8ball · Senior Poster (Nominates their colour)

Beefy wrote;

It seemed a simple equation last year

Get picked

win games and stay in - lose games and you were dropped

Seems a fair enough way to me.

Check the stats for last year and you will see this is not the case, some players were dropped after losing, yet other players were picked again after losing, sometimes 2 or 3 in a row.

The trouble is there will always be favourite / prefered players as again is the case with this topic

OxfordRob · Occasional Poster (Racking up the balls)

For what it is worth I personally appreciated there being a trials day. It gives every one a good chance to weigh up their own playing strengths (or in my case weaknesses). I learnt so much that day just watching and playing. I am in no way good enough yet but it has given me the motivation to improve my game and come back next year to try again. I hold my hat off to Kevin McIlroy and every one else involved in running the trials and trying to make it as fair and smooth running as possible. Good luck to the Oxfordshire team and everyone that is playing.

Milhouse · Ultimate Poster (2-0 up in a best of 7)

Barney wrote:

Beefy wrote: I am still waiting for the official list so I can sort out the best way to collect moneis and have an adequate record of what is taken in on Sunday including shirt names and sizes etc ! e-mail me please. keith.hollis@yahoo.co.uk Beefy, I gave Kev £5 on Monday. Plus I think Watty did the same. I'm away this weekend so won't see you Sunday.

Is there anyone actually going on Sunday ?

Luckylewis · Even if you beat me I’m STILL THE BEST ;-)

Barney wrote:

I'm away this weekend so won't see you Sunday.